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Allen is depressing

1 by CaptSMRT
I'm tired of seeing his sad ass face. I don't know what his problem is...he probably missed a hug when he was nine or some bullshit. Two of those goals should have been stopped last night, and that is every fucking game...he is not going to get better. I am calling it a career for him. He could get shutouts every game for the rest of the season and I wouldn't trust him. Please GOD inspire him to join a religious cult or something that would deliver the message to his brain that he does not belong in the NHL...or even a beer league.

FUCK!!!!

Re: Allen is depressing

6 by Dave's a mess
Some of the best, most consistent comedy out there these days is when Pang breaks down one of Allen's soft goals, particularly the first replay. The second goal last night is a great example, he was giving Allen the benefit of the doubt, it was probably tipped or something, but then on that first slow-mo replay, nope, just right between the legs clean. It kind of breaks Pang's optimistic little heart every time.
...but whatever, the Blues won the Cup!!!!!

Re: Allen is depressing

7 by BillP.
MattyIce wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:42 am At this point the relationship is just toxic. The fans hate him, he has zero confidence, and I'm sure the team doesn't have confidence in him. It would be to the benefit of both the team AND Allen if he went to another team.
I agree, problem is we never consider trades until its doom and gloom time. Good luck trading Allen away. We're out of picks........

Re: Allen is depressing

8 by Ozzies09tc
Armstrong is depressing.
We've all known jake allen is bi-polar and the team plays hard early in the season then deflates after he, well, jake allen's.

I put blame on pie and steen as well for not "rallying the troops" but only so much rallying can be done before even they stop caring.

To my next point is the beaten-dead-horse that is our "craptain".

EVERYTHING in my diatribe above is all from one guy.

It's time for a new army.
Now now, the Canadian Government has apologized for Bryan Adams on SEVERAL occasions!

Re: Allen is depressing

9 by CaptSMRT
Dave's a mess wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 8:57 am Some of the best, most consistent comedy out there these days is when Pang breaks down one of Allen's soft goals, particularly the first replay. The second goal last night is a great example, he was giving Allen the benefit of the doubt, it was probably tipped or something, but then on that first slow-mo replay, nope, just right between the legs clean. It kind of breaks Pang's optimistic little heart every time.
Did you hear JK cringing when the Stars had the puck near the left post late in the third period...nobody has confidence in this guy.

Re: Allen is depressing

10 by CaptSMRT
Ozzies09tc wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:26 am Armstrong is depressing.
We've all known jake allen is bi-polar and the team plays hard early in the season then deflates after he, well, jake allen's.

I put blame on pie and steen as well for not "rallying the troops" but only so much rallying can be done before even they stop caring.

To my next point is the beaten-dead-horse that is our "craptain".

EVERYTHING in my diatribe above is all from one guy.

It's time for a new army.
I don't see how Armstrong can redeem himself.

Re: Allen is depressing

13 by Dread_Pirate_Westley
Now if you want me to kick you in the nuts while you're depressed? I'll do it for goals against average.

#5 Bishop 2.36
#6 Halak 2.36
#15 Hutton 2.57
#16 Elliott 2.59
#17 Copley 2.59
#39 Allen 3.07

Yup, 5 of the Blues former goalies that were ditched in favor of Allen are top 17 in GAA.
Just a Russian propaganda account

Re: Allen is depressing

14 by BluesSK
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:23 pm You want to be depressed?

Save % with a minimum of 14 starts

#3 Halak .926
#8 Bishop .923
#15 Hutton .918
#17 Copley .916
#25 Elliott .911
#40 Allen .896

Every single Blues goalie that was passed up for Allen is out performing him. By a lot.
Ben Bishop was never really passed up for Jake Allen. He was passed up for Brian Elliott. [Edit: A move which I really hated at the time]

Also, to be totally nit-picky Anders Nilsson has 13 starts (14 games total) and is .890 and 3.19 :D

Re: Allen is depressing

16 by Ozzies09tc
BluesSK wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:42 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:23 pm You want to be depressed?

Save % with a minimum of 14 starts

#3 Halak .926
#8 Bishop .923
#15 Hutton .918
#17 Copley .916
#25 Elliott .911
#40 Allen .896

Every single Blues goalie that was passed up for Allen is out performing him. By a lot.
Ben Bishop was never really passed up for Jake Allen. He was passed up for Brian Elliott. [Edit: A move which I really hated at the time]

Also, to be totally nit-picky Anders Nilsson has 13 starts (14 games total) and is .890 and 3.19 :D
IIRC it was for Jarosuck Halot (consequently ALSO outplaying Allen)
Now now, the Canadian Government has apologized for Bryan Adams on SEVERAL occasions!

Re: Allen is depressing

17 by Turk Sanderson
BluesSK wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:42 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:23 pm You want to be depressed?

Save % with a minimum of 14 starts

#3 Halak .926
#8 Bishop .923
#15 Hutton .918
#17 Copley .916
#25 Elliott .911
#40 Allen .896

Every single Blues goalie that was passed up for Allen is out performing him. By a lot.
Ben Bishop was never really passed up for Jake Allen. He was passed up for Brian Elliott. [Edit: A move which I really hated at the time]

Also, to be totally nit-picky Anders Nilsson has 13 starts (14 games total) and is .890 and 3.19 :D
Brian Elliott was the right goalie for the team that they had at the time.... Hitch was a blockhead for running him off.

Re: Allen is depressing

18 by bradleygt89
BluesSK wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:42 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:23 pm You want to be depressed?

Save % with a minimum of 14 starts

#3 Halak .926
#8 Bishop .923
#15 Hutton .918
#17 Copley .916
#25 Elliott .911
#40 Allen .896

Every single Blues goalie that was passed up for Allen is out performing him. By a lot.
Ben Bishop was never really passed up for Jake Allen. He was passed up for Brian Elliott. [Edit: A move which I really hated at the time]

Also, to be totally nit-picky Anders Nilsson has 13 starts (14 games total) and is .890 and 3.19 :D
Is it the goalie, or the team in front, or both? Sorry, but Halak was rode out of town because 'he sucks' (I cannot think of too many fans who were sad we traded Halak for Miller...except for me :) ).

Elliott and Hutton: both often injured, and have never been a 'true #1' (neither have ever started or played in more than 50 games in a season) and never will. Sabres are now falling and will soon be out of the playoffs, and Hutton has lost 8 of his last 10 games.

Bishop is really the only goalie who has succeeded as a true #1, and even he is often injured to where Dallas will miss the playoffs once he gets hurt again.

Copley is a career backup, nothing pretty there.

Allen is like MOST NHL goalies in that he needs to be managed correctly. He may say he likes all the starts, and what athlete doesn't want to be competing? But as I've said for the last couple years, you CANNOT give Allen more than 50 starts AND no more than 5-6 in a row. After that he break down, as do most 'average' NHL goalies. Allen has always succeeded best when he played less than 50 games: 14/15 he was .913 with a 2.28 GAA in 37 games, and in 15/16 he was .920 with a 2.35 GAA ins 47 games. That should be his limit. He already has 33 freaking starts out of the 41 the Blues have played. Shame on DA for not getting him an adequate backup who can handle 30 + starts, OR for not finding a true #1 who can play the 60 plus games they seem to want out of their goalie.

Also, goal support. For those in our fantasy league, I love having Vasilevskiy: but he has giving up 5 goals in three of his last 6 starts! But they won 2 of those 3 games because the Lightning have got the goal support.

Trade Allen sure if you can, but until this team has better leadership from FO down, better top 9 players who can score when the goalie is having an off game, it won't matter who is in the net. /

LSS: Allen is tied with Hellebuyck with 33 games started for 4th in the NHL this season. Only Dubnyk (34), Gibson (35), and Fleury (39) have more starts. This is terrible asset management by DA and the coaches to overuse an average goalie like Jake, who excels best when he is partnered with someone who can take on around 30 starts per season.
"Do Only Good Everyday"

Re: Allen is depressing

19 by Dread_Pirate_Westley
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:19 pm
BluesSK wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:42 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:23 pm You want to be depressed?

Save % with a minimum of 14 starts

#3 Halak .926
#8 Bishop .923
#15 Hutton .918
#17 Copley .916
#25 Elliott .911
#40 Allen .896

Every single Blues goalie that was passed up for Allen is out performing him. By a lot.
Ben Bishop was never really passed up for Jake Allen. He was passed up for Brian Elliott. [Edit: A move which I really hated at the time]

Also, to be totally nit-picky Anders Nilsson has 13 starts (14 games total) and is .890 and 3.19 :D
Is it the goalie, or the team in front, or both?
Both. Allen isn't the sole reason for the Blues issue and he certainly isn't this teams only issue. But we only have to look at yesterday's game as the perfect example of his problems. The 3rd goal he let in was BRUTAL. It wasn't the one singular reason the team lost the game, but in the NHL and on this team specifically, the margin for error are so slim. When you have a goalie you can't rely on, that's a tough thing for a team to overcome. Lack of confidence in your goalie can impact how everyone on the ice plays. They end up playing tight, slow, and over thinking it. Instead of how the best teams play. Sharp, fast, aggressive hockey.

The contract extension DA gave Allen has been his single greatest blunder as a GM. It's prevented this team from ever addressing the real issue and being a true contender. Other, better goalies have become available in his time here that the Blues couldn't make a move on because they were married to Allen. Instead they've made other roster moves in an attempt to overcome the goaltending issues, that have only compounded the issues.
Just a Russian propaganda account

Re: Allen is depressing

20 by bradleygt89
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:37 pm
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:19 pm
BluesSK wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:42 pm

Ben Bishop was never really passed up for Jake Allen. He was passed up for Brian Elliott. [Edit: A move which I really hated at the time]

Also, to be totally nit-picky Anders Nilsson has 13 starts (14 games total) and is .890 and 3.19 :D
Is it the goalie, or the team in front, or both?
Both. Allen isn't the sole reason for the Blues issue and he certainly isn't this teams only issue. But we only have to look at yesterday's game as the perfect example of his problems. The 3rd goal he let in was BRUTAL. It wasn't the one singular reason the team lost the game, but in the NHL and on this team specifically, the margin for error are so slim. When you have a goalie you can't rely on, that's a tough thing for a team to overcome. Lack of confidence in your goalie can impact how everyone on the ice plays. They end up playing tight, slow, and over thinking it. Instead of how the best teams play. Sharp, fast, aggressive hockey.

The contract extension DA gave Allen has been his single greatest blunder as a GM. It's prevented this team from ever addressing the real issue and being a true contender. Other, better goalies have become available in his time here that the Blues couldn't make a move on because they were married to Allen. Instead they've made other roster moves in an attempt to overcome the goaltending issues, that have only compounded the issues.
May I ask which goalies you are referring to as 'better goalies that have become available'? Not being argumentative, but outside of some career backups, I'm not sure what potential #1 goalie has been moved or made available in the last 3 or 4 years, other than Bishop.
"Do Only Good Everyday"

Re: Allen is depressing

21 by Dave's a mess
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:50 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:37 pm
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:19 pm

Is it the goalie, or the team in front, or both?
Both. Allen isn't the sole reason for the Blues issue and he certainly isn't this teams only issue. But we only have to look at yesterday's game as the perfect example of his problems. The 3rd goal he let in was BRUTAL. It wasn't the one singular reason the team lost the game, but in the NHL and on this team specifically, the margin for error are so slim. When you have a goalie you can't rely on, that's a tough thing for a team to overcome. Lack of confidence in your goalie can impact how everyone on the ice plays. They end up playing tight, slow, and over thinking it. Instead of how the best teams play. Sharp, fast, aggressive hockey.

The contract extension DA gave Allen has been his single greatest blunder as a GM. It's prevented this team from ever addressing the real issue and being a true contender. Other, better goalies have become available in his time here that the Blues couldn't make a move on because they were married to Allen. Instead they've made other roster moves in an attempt to overcome the goaltending issues, that have only compounded the issues.
May I ask which goalies you are referring to as 'better goalies that have become available'? Not being argumentative, but outside of some career backups, I'm not sure what potential #1 goalie has been moved or made available in the last 3 or 4 years, other than Bishop.
I might not be remembering the details correctly, and I know I was (foolishly) opposed to the move at the time, but I think Fleury would qualify.
...but whatever, the Blues won the Cup!!!!!

Re: Allen is depressing

22 by MattyIce
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:19 pm
BluesSK wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:42 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:23 pm You want to be depressed?

Save % with a minimum of 14 starts

#3 Halak .926
#8 Bishop .923
#15 Hutton .918
#17 Copley .916
#25 Elliott .911
#40 Allen .896

Every single Blues goalie that was passed up for Allen is out performing him. By a lot.
Ben Bishop was never really passed up for Jake Allen. He was passed up for Brian Elliott. [Edit: A move which I really hated at the time]

Also, to be totally nit-picky Anders Nilsson has 13 starts (14 games total) and is .890 and 3.19 :D
Is it the goalie, or the team in front, or both? Sorry, but Halak was rode out of town because 'he sucks' (I cannot think of too many fans who were sad we traded Halak for Miller...except for me :) ).

Elliott and Hutton: both often injured, and have never been a 'true #1' (neither have ever started or played in more than 50 games in a season) and never will. Sabres are now falling and will soon be out of the playoffs, and Hutton has lost 8 of his last 10 games.

Bishop is really the only goalie who has succeeded as a true #1, and even he is often injured to where Dallas will miss the playoffs once he gets hurt again.

Copley is a career backup, nothing pretty there.

Allen is like MOST NHL goalies in that he needs to be managed correctly. He may say he likes all the starts, and what athlete doesn't want to be competing? But as I've said for the last couple years, you CANNOT give Allen more than 50 starts AND no more than 5-6 in a row. After that he break down, as do most 'average' NHL goalies. Allen has always succeeded best when he played less than 50 games: 14/15 he was .913 with a 2.28 GAA in 37 games, and in 15/16 he was .920 with a 2.35 GAA ins 47 games. That should be his limit. He already has 33 freaking starts out of the 41 the Blues have played. Shame on DA for not getting him an adequate backup who can handle 30 + starts, OR for not finding a true #1 who can play the 60 plus games they seem to want out of their goalie.

Also, goal support. For those in our fantasy league, I love having Vasilevskiy: but he has giving up 5 goals in three of his last 6 starts! But they won 2 of those 3 games because the Lightning have got the goal support.

Trade Allen sure if you can, but until this team has better leadership from FO down, better top 9 players who can score when the goalie is having an off game, it won't matter who is in the net. /

LSS: Allen is tied with Hellebuyck with 33 games started for 4th in the NHL this season. Only Dubnyk (34), Gibson (35), and Fleury (39) have more starts. This is terrible asset management by DA and the coaches to overuse an average goalie like Jake, who excels best when he is partnered with someone who can take on around 30 starts per season.
Really nice post Bradley. A lot of good points in there.
Elliott bothers me a lot because he took you to the WCF. He was also a leader in the locker room. That same offseason you lost Backes & Brouwer, then Reaves and Shatty after that. That's a lot of leadership in those 5 guys that almost got you to the promised land. Plus, leadership is the thing we all complain about with this team.
Letting Hutton go seemed crazy at the time and still seems crazy. Jake had 2 rough years in a row. Hutton was one of the top goalies in the league statistically. When you let a guy like that walk in favor of a guy that has been struggling at times, you better be ready for some criticism if the guy you chose get gets outperformed.
KA-KAW!

Re: Allen is depressing

23 by insideout
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:50 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:37 pm
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:19 pm

Is it the goalie, or the team in front, or both?
Both. Allen isn't the sole reason for the Blues issue and he certainly isn't this teams only issue. But we only have to look at yesterday's game as the perfect example of his problems. The 3rd goal he let in was BRUTAL. It wasn't the one singular reason the team lost the game, but in the NHL and on this team specifically, the margin for error are so slim. When you have a goalie you can't rely on, that's a tough thing for a team to overcome. Lack of confidence in your goalie can impact how everyone on the ice plays. They end up playing tight, slow, and over thinking it. Instead of how the best teams play. Sharp, fast, aggressive hockey.

The contract extension DA gave Allen has been his single greatest blunder as a GM. It's prevented this team from ever addressing the real issue and being a true contender. Other, better goalies have become available in his time here that the Blues couldn't make a move on because they were married to Allen. Instead they've made other roster moves in an attempt to overcome the goaltending issues, that have only compounded the issues.
May I ask which goalies you are referring to as 'better goalies that have become available'? Not being argumentative, but outside of some career backups, I'm not sure what potential #1 goalie has been moved or made available in the last 3 or 4 years, other than Bishop.
A career backup at a career backup's salary would have been a better choice. Had they gone that route, they would have had (a) a better goalie and (b) the flexibility to get a legitimate #1 should one become available. Also, without naming anyone specific, it is reasonable to assume that at some point within the last 3 or 4 years, Armstrong could have landed a better starting goalie than Allen. That's not a huge stretch.

Re: Allen is depressing

24 by Dread_Pirate_Westley
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:50 pm
Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:37 pm
bradleygt89 wrote: Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:19 pm

Is it the goalie, or the team in front, or both?
Both. Allen isn't the sole reason for the Blues issue and he certainly isn't this teams only issue. But we only have to look at yesterday's game as the perfect example of his problems. The 3rd goal he let in was BRUTAL. It wasn't the one singular reason the team lost the game, but in the NHL and on this team specifically, the margin for error are so slim. When you have a goalie you can't rely on, that's a tough thing for a team to overcome. Lack of confidence in your goalie can impact how everyone on the ice plays. They end up playing tight, slow, and over thinking it. Instead of how the best teams play. Sharp, fast, aggressive hockey.

The contract extension DA gave Allen has been his single greatest blunder as a GM. It's prevented this team from ever addressing the real issue and being a true contender. Other, better goalies have become available in his time here that the Blues couldn't make a move on because they were married to Allen. Instead they've made other roster moves in an attempt to overcome the goaltending issues, that have only compounded the issues.
May I ask which goalies you are referring to as 'better goalies that have become available'? Not being argumentative, but outside of some career backups, I'm not sure what potential #1 goalie has been moved or made available in the last 3 or 4 years, other than Bishop.
The one that immediately jumps to mind for me is MAF.

Edit: Frederik Andersen is another guy they could've likely had, if they were able to/wanted to.
Last edited by Dread_Pirate_Westley on Wed Jan 09, 2019 4:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Just a Russian propaganda account

Re: Allen is depressing

25 by bradleygt89
Yeah, in a perfect world they would have kept either Elliott or Hutton as a the 'backup' to Jake, but I think both Elliott and Hutton thought they could go off and be #1's elsewhere. Realistically, none of the three are true #1s and all three teams they are playing for will suffer the consequences of a GM being too high on the 'we must have a true #1 goalie' thinking, instead of realizing that it is OK to have a bad ass tandem if you don't have that guy, which again, none of those three are.
"Do Only Good Everyday"
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