Any guesses at what he's probably looking at getting from the Blues?

Does a team dare offer sheet him? Because how many times do you get the chance to bid on a 25 year old Stanley Cup winning goalie.

I am absolutely stumped on this one. Before the playoffs I thought he'd be looking at an AAV in the $4.0M range, but then he won the damn Cup (remember that guys?!?!). Matt Murray signed for 3 years at 3.75 per after one of his Cup wins. Pretty good comp but not quite the same situation, and the RFA market has swung towards the players being more aggressive since then. Plus, after all the celebrating winds down, would it surprise anyone at all if Binnington drives an incredibly hard bargain after what he's been through the last few years? Also what kind of term is the team comfortable with? What about from Binnington's side? I really have no freaking idea on this one, but I'll say they end up at $20 million over 4 years, for an AAV of $5M. I'll be fascinated to see how wrong I am.

My guess is 5 years, $6M per. Hellebuyck makes $6.1, Gibson makes $6.4, freaking Martin Jones makes $5.75.

Jake Allen makes $4.35...you know Binnington and his agent are going to be pointing to that. Which damn, had Allen not fallen apart, what a great contract that would have been for a starting goalie when you look at how much a guy like Jones makes.

I wonder if JB50 wants long term now or to prove it for another couple years and then back up the brinks truck.

I can see 3 years at between 5-5.5 aav

Antti Niemi won the Stanley Cup with Chicago, went to arbitration, and was awarded a one year, 2.75 million dollar deal. And Chicago walked away from that deal.

Because of the volatile nature of the position, more than often teams get bit by extending goalies to those 5 / 6 year deals.

I think Binnington gets a 3 year deal worth 4 to 4.5 million.

SpacemanSpiff wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:53 pm Antti Niemi won the Stanley Cup with Chicago, went to arbitration, and was awarded a one year, 2.75 million dollar deal. And Chicago walked away from that deal.

Because of the volatile nature of the position, more than often teams get bit by extending goalies to those 5 / 6 year deals.

I think Binnington gets a 3 year deal worth 4 to 4.5 million.

Niemi isn’t really a good comparison. He had a less than .500% quality start position his one full year, Binnington’s was .667% this past year. His save percentage was .912, Binnington’s this season was .927.

He’s a ufa in 2 years I believe, so if I’m him I want to go year to year or go 5-6+ years.
I’d say either 1 year @ $4m or 5 years @ $6m-ish

UMSLBlues12 wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:59 pm

SpacemanSpiff wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:53 pm Antti Niemi won the Stanley Cup with Chicago, went to arbitration, and was awarded a one year, 2.75 million dollar deal. And Chicago walked away from that deal.

Because of the volatile nature of the position, more than often teams get bit by extending goalies to those 5 / 6 year deals.

I think Binnington gets a 3 year deal worth 4 to 4.5 million.

Niemi isn’t really a good comparison. He had a less than .500% quality start position his one full year, Binnington’s was .667% this past year. His save percentage was .912, Binnington’s this season was .927.

That whole offseason was interesting for the Hawks. Besides the Niemi issue, the Hawks also were dealing with Hjalmarsson reaching RFA status and were very tight against the cap. San Jose, who the Hawks had just swept in the conference final, got aggressive and signed Hjalmarsson to an offer sheet, putting the Hawks in even more of a pinch. The Hawks matched the Hjalmarsson offer sheet, and as Spiff noted, walked away from the Niemi arbitration deal, valuing the cap space instead. The Sharks went ahead and signed Niemi once he became a free agent. I loved that cutthroat move by Doug Wilson. Niemi had some good years in San Jose before he started to decline. Meanwhile Chicago made the right call opting to keep Hjalmarsson over Niemi. Hope we see more offer sheets this year, but not involving Binnington.

Boy, you guys are giving out some money. I'm thinking Army will shoot for the 2.5M to 3.0M range. Maybe a 2 or 3 year deal. Maybe make the 3rd year a player option. Still very good for a guy that was going nowhere not too long ago.

BillP. wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:14 pm Boy, you guys are giving out some money. I'm thinking Army will shoot for the 2.5M to 3.0M range. Maybe a 2 or 3 year deal. Maybe make the 3rd year a player option. Still very good for a guy that was going nowhere not too long ago.

I don't believe the NHL allows option years. I know he was going nowhere as recently as Thanksgiving, but if he doesn't at least get 4.5/year he has the worst agent in the world. I'm curious what kind of term Binnington would prefer. 2 years gets him to UFA, but long term security is always nice.

I'm thinking 4.5-5.5 for 4-6 years, along with a 50% chance the Sun engulfs the Earth in 5-6 billion years.

I'd prefer to not sign him long term, 1to2 year 4.5 seems reasonable, just in case he turns out to be a flash in the pan. Army has saddled this team before with some pretty shitty long termers. I think he'll be a little gun shy.

BlueinNy wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:13 pm I'd prefer to not sign him long term, 1to2 year 4.5 seems reasonable, just in case he turns out to be a flash in the pan. Army has saddled this team before with some pretty shitty long termers. I think he'll be a little gun shy.

I think if you offer him that contract, he starts looking around the league for an offer.

Dread_Pirate_Westley wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:29 pm

BlueinNy wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:13 pm I'd prefer to not sign him long term, 1to2 year 4.5 seems reasonable, just in case he turns out to be a flash in the pan. Army has saddled this team before with some pretty shitty long termers. I think he'll be a little gun shy.

I think if you offer him that contract, he starts looking around the league for an offer.

IF DA offered that deal, hopefully he would be looking around the league for a new GM position. No way DA goes less than 4 years. 2 years takes him right to UFA, so while great for Binnington, it would be terrible for the Blues unless they really have confidence that Husso or someone else can come along and 'be the guy'.

In the for reals, I do think he gets 5 years at $5M/ as Dave mentioned. I think that is a fair deal for a 25 year old goaltender who may not have a huge NHL resume, but has shown he has what it takes to do the most important thing: Win a Championship. And IIRC, besides the SC, he also won the memorial Cup back in 10/11 so the kid isn't some 'flash in the pan' as he had very good stats in the AHL too...he just never got his shot because he wasn't as orthodox or 'sexy' as other goalies in the system. I have no doubt that Binnington will continue to be a great top 10 goalie for his NHL career.

Binnington took us to the Stanley Cup. We finally found a goalie that could take us there, and we’re going to have to pay him. Army even said it on the radio...”we’re looking forward to paying him.”

To me, it’s either going to be 5 years or 1 year. I can’t pretend to know what Army’s cap hit number is for a 5 year deal, but I imagine somewhere between 5x5 or 5x6. My guess is 5x6. The only way I see it getting to one year is if they can’t come to an agreement on a longer term deal...could end up being 1 year, 3.5-4.5 or something. Problem with doing that is if Binnington plays next year on a one year deal with a save percentage of .925+, he’s going to command more money and term than 5x5 or 5x6.

Does the name Allen bring any memories?

BlueinNy wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:22 pm Does the name Allen bring any memories?

Allen didn’t win this team a Stanley Cup. The mistake with Allen was that Army didn’t need to pay him yet...he was still another year away from needing to. When a guy takes you to a championship you have to pay him...the bill comes due. Good goalies are hard to come by in this league, and if we don’t step up and pay him someone else will.

UMSLBlues12 wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:00 am My guess is 5 years, $6M per. Hellebuyck makes $6.1, Gibson makes $6.4, freaking Martin Jones makes $5.75.

Jake Allen makes $4.35...you know Binnington and his agent are going to be pointing to that. Which damn, had Allen not fallen apart, what a great contract that would have been for a starting goalie when you look at how much a guy like Jones makes.

If Allen doesn't fall apart the Blues don't win the Cup.

CaptSMRT wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:37 am

UMSLBlues12 wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:00 am My guess is 5 years, $6M per. Hellebuyck makes $6.1, Gibson makes $6.4, freaking Martin Jones makes $5.75.

Jake Allen makes $4.35...you know Binnington and his agent are going to be pointing to that. Which damn, had Allen not fallen apart, what a great contract that would have been for a starting goalie when you look at how much a guy like Jones makes.

If Allen doesn't fall apart the Blues don't win the Cup.

he should definitely get paid for that effort.

UMSLBlues12 wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:18 am

BlueinNy wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:22 pm Does the name Allen bring any memories?

Allen didn’t win this team a Stanley Cup. The mistake with Allen was that Army didn’t need to pay him yet...he was still another year away from needing to. When a guy takes you to a championship you have to pay him...the bill comes due. Good goalies are hard to come by in this league, and if we don’t step up and pay him someone else will.

Dont get me wrong, he deserves a raise, but it's a small sample size is my only worry.

Either sign him 1 year or long term, nothing in between due to him with only 2 years of RFA left. I believe that he will get a better offer for 1 year from Army than he would from arbitration. I don't expect an offer sheet because goaltenders are too risky and his sample size is small, despite winning the cup. I think though, based on his performance in the AHL over the last couple of years and this past NHL season, he is the real deal and if Army wants to risk it, a long term deal would be smart cap space wise.

BlueinNy wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2019 8:06 am

UMSLBlues12 wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:18 am

BlueinNy wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:22 pm Does the name Allen bring any memories?

Allen didn’t win this team a Stanley Cup. The mistake with Allen was that Army didn’t need to pay him yet...he was still another year away from needing to. When a guy takes you to a championship you have to pay him...the bill comes due. Good goalies are hard to come by in this league, and if we don’t step up and pay him someone else will.

Dont get me wrong, he deserves a raise, but it's a small sample size is my only worry.

I really think that's an entirely valid concern. Hell I share it as well, but I just think they're going to have to pay in the $5M/year range if they want to keep him. Goalies are voodoo, there's no doubt. It's just such an unprecedented situation, it'll be very interesting to see how it plays out.

BillP. wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:14 pm Boy, you guys are giving out some money. I'm thinking Army will shoot for the 2.5M to 3.0M range. Maybe a 2 or 3 year deal. Maybe make the 3rd year a player option. Still very good for a guy that was going nowhere not too long ago.

I'd love to get him locked in at that but I don't see how they can convince him to take that little. Goalies are up and down from year to year (even the greats these days). But I don't see how we get him signed for less than 5 million per.

UMSLBlues12 wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:18 am

BlueinNy wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:22 pm Does the name Allen bring any memories?

Allen didn’t win this team a Stanley Cup. The mistake with Allen was that Army didn’t need to pay him yet...he was still another year away from needing to. When a guy takes you to a championship you have to pay him...the bill comes due. Good goalies are hard to come by in this league, and if we don’t step up and pay him someone else will.

Agree with everything you said.

Jake Allen has nothing to do with how the Blues go about JB50.

You wouldn't not pay a forward because Jori Lehtera sucked.

ratonmono wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:24 pm

BillP. wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:14 pm Boy, you guys are giving out some money. I'm thinking Army will shoot for the 2.5M to 3.0M range. Maybe a 2 or 3 year deal. Maybe make the 3rd year a player option. Still very good for a guy that was going nowhere not too long ago.

I'd love to get him locked in at that but I don't see how they can convince him to take that little. Goalies are up and down from year to year (even the greats these days). But I don't see how we get him signed for less than 5 million per.

Agreed. Binner just won us our only Cup. If I'm Army, I can't look Binner in the eye and offer him less than 4.5 mill for 3 years. I expect him to get 5 mill, and imo, he earned it. If he falls apart, so be it. How do you put a price on winning the Stanley Cup?