I was thinking through both what our top-6 might look like without Tarasenko to start next year as well about Thomas' development and curious about all of your thoughts.
Right now there are 4 obvious top-6 guys in ROR, DP57, Schenn and Schwartz. 2 of which are centers and 2 are wings. The more I think about it, Thomas needs to be moved up to one of those lines. He is pretty clearly (see stats below) our 5th best offensive forward at the moment and while there is room for growth, I don't want to keep him on the third line just to get more center experience and shelter his minutes. I am ready to see what we have. Stats from last year's forward group are below:
Name PPG PPP Avg TOI
ROR .86 18 20:54
Perron .85 27 18:19
Schenn .81 21 18:28
Schwartz .80 20 18:11
Thomas .64 7 14:34
Sanford .52 1 13:44
Bozak .43 4 15:19
Assuming no additions, I would start with something like:
Sanford-ROR-Perron
Schwartz-Schenn-Thomas
Blais-Bozak-Kyrou (or Sunny)
(Steen/Mac/DLR)-Barbs-Sunny (or filler)
This puts 2 (relative) finishers around ROR in Sanford/Perron and 2 around Thomas in Schwartz and Schenn. Plus Thomas and Schenn can take draws on strong sides.
Re: Robert Thomas
2I’ve said before that I think Thomas has the ability to be a poor man’s Braden Point. Same size (Thomas actually a bit bigger), same quickness, etc, but Thomas is 3 years younger. I’m definitely in agreement that he is ready to be surrounded by better players. You play him as your #2 center and I think he puts up 60+ points. Hell, he was on pace for 52 this past season, if they had played a full season.
Re: Robert Thomas
3Yeah. We need to find out what his ceiling is and not just his potential. He needs to play in the top two lines.
Re: Robert Thomas
4That was the top 6 they were using at the end of the Vancouver series, and I don't expect next season will be any different. The only catch is either Schenn or Thomas has to play on the wing. Personally I'd rather have Thomas in the middle due to his superior skating, but whatever works. This season needs to be Thomas's breakout year statistically if he's going to be what we think/hope he will be. He's not going to hit those numbers on the third line.
...but whatever, the Blues won the Cup!!!!!
Re: Robert Thomas
5IMO for the Blues to be a true contender next year, they need Thomas to make the jump into the top six and Kyrou to become a productive everyday player. I know Perron, ROR, and Sanford play well together, but man I hate seeing Sanford's name on the top line
KA-KAW!
Re: Robert Thomas
6I think it depends on who’s who at Center for Blues. If both Schenn and Thomas are at a Center, then Thomas is still a 3rd liner next year. Which is fine for me. Gives the Blues the potential for a strong 3rd line if Thomas amps up his game. Now who is on that 3rd line will be fun to watch. If Bozak gets dealt to open up cap then it’s wide open.MattyIce wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:18 pm IMO for the Blues to be a true contender next year, they need Thomas to make the jump into the top six and Kyrou to become a productive everyday player. I know Perron, ROR, and Sanford play well together, but man I hate seeing Sanford's name on the top line
Re: Robert Thomas
7There are two very big, yet very addressable differences between Point and Thomas. Point has developed enough confidence in his shot at the NHL level to use it often and effectively. Thomas sees shooting as a last resort (I believe) because he lacks that same confidence. Similarly, while Point drives the zone with speed and continues to pressure the defense by driving the net or cycling with speed, Thomas’ default setting is to pull up after gaining the zone and look for a passing lane in which to distribute the puck.Matangama wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:45 pm I’ve said before that I think Thomas has the ability to be a poor man’s Braden Point. Same size (Thomas actually a bit bigger), same quickness, etc, but Thomas is 3 years younger. I’m definitely in agreement that he is ready to be surrounded by better players. You play him as your #2 center and I think he puts up 60+ points. Hell, he was on pace for 52 this past season, if they had played a full season.
I would never want to coach Thomas’ instincts out of him, but the coaching staff needs to instill enough confidence in him to make the things that Point does so well a part of his repertoire so he is not so predictable.
Re: Robert Thomas
8You called it. Point is a shoot first guy whereas Thomas is a pass first guy.MissouriMook wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:36 pmThere are two very big, yet very addressable differences between Point and Thomas. Point has developed enough confidence in his shot at the NHL level to use it often and effectively. Thomas sees shooting as a last resort (I believe) because he lacks that same confidence. Similarly, while Point drives the zone with speed and continues to pressure the defense by driving the net or cycling with speed, Thomas’ default setting is to pull up after gaining the zone and look for a passing lane in which to distribute the puck.Matangama wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:45 pm I’ve said before that I think Thomas has the ability to be a poor man’s Braden Point. Same size (Thomas actually a bit bigger), same quickness, etc, but Thomas is 3 years younger. I’m definitely in agreement that he is ready to be surrounded by better players. You play him as your #2 center and I think he puts up 60+ points. Hell, he was on pace for 52 this past season, if they had played a full season.
I would never want to coach Thomas’ instincts out of him, but the coaching staff needs to instill enough confidence in him to make the things that Point does so well a part of his repertoire so he is not so predictable.
Re: Robert Thomas
9Mook, I agree with what you say. I’m hoping the coaches told Thomas to watch Point during the playoffs. I think he has very similar skills, and that 3 year age difference gives me confidence he can keep raising his game. Not saying he will become Point, because that’s a really high bar, but at least move in that direction.MissouriMook wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:36 pmThere are two very big, yet very addressable differences between Point and Thomas. Point has developed enough confidence in his shot at the NHL level to use it often and effectively. Thomas sees shooting as a last resort (I believe) because he lacks that same confidence. Similarly, while Point drives the zone with speed and continues to pressure the defense by driving the net or cycling with speed, Thomas’ default setting is to pull up after gaining the zone and look for a passing lane in which to distribute the puck.Matangama wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:45 pm I’ve said before that I think Thomas has the ability to be a poor man’s Braden Point. Same size (Thomas actually a bit bigger), same quickness, etc, but Thomas is 3 years younger. I’m definitely in agreement that he is ready to be surrounded by better players. You play him as your #2 center and I think he puts up 60+ points. Hell, he was on pace for 52 this past season, if they had played a full season.
I would never want to coach Thomas’ instincts out of him, but the coaching staff needs to instill enough confidence in him to make the things that Point does so well a part of his repertoire so he is not so predictable.
Re: Robert Thomas
10I recall Schwartz having the exact same problem when he first came up. He grew out of it, and most youngsters do, but it's a problem until it happens. Now Schwartz almost never has the problem of not shooting. I always get a kick out of when he rushes the puck up the ice without any help (frequently his linemates are changing) and he fires a slapper from the circle like Geoff Courtnall. It NEVER goes in since modern goalies eat shots like that for lunch, but he'll never stop shooting it in that scenario. That's not a criticism by the way, he's got no support so might as well throw one on net before going off on a change, but it makes me chuckle every damn time that the tiniest guy on the team is winding up and taking clappers from 40 feet out.MissouriMook wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:36 pmThere are two very big, yet very addressable differences between Point and Thomas. Point has developed enough confidence in his shot at the NHL level to use it often and effectively. Thomas sees shooting as a last resort (I believe) because he lacks that same confidence. Similarly, while Point drives the zone with speed and continues to pressure the defense by driving the net or cycling with speed, Thomas’ default setting is to pull up after gaining the zone and look for a passing lane in which to distribute the puck.Matangama wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:45 pm I’ve said before that I think Thomas has the ability to be a poor man’s Braden Point. Same size (Thomas actually a bit bigger), same quickness, etc, but Thomas is 3 years younger. I’m definitely in agreement that he is ready to be surrounded by better players. You play him as your #2 center and I think he puts up 60+ points. Hell, he was on pace for 52 this past season, if they had played a full season.
I would never want to coach Thomas’ instincts out of him, but the coaching staff needs to instill enough confidence in him to make the things that Point does so well a part of his repertoire so he is not so predictable.
...but whatever, the Blues won the Cup!!!!!
Re: Robert Thomas
11I would be fine with Thomas playing on the wing next year if it means he's in the top 6. He will be a center longer-term, but if they like Schenn better in that role next year, I'm good with that. Hard for me to get excited about Thomas on the third line again unless they get a good finisher to play off his passing skills on that line. I guess he could make up for the lack of 5-on-5 time on the third line with more PP time.BillP. wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 6:06 pmI think it depends on who’s who at Center for Blues. If both Schenn and Thomas are at a Center, then Thomas is still a 3rd liner next year. Which is fine for me. Gives the Blues the potential for a strong 3rd line if Thomas amps up his game. Now who is on that 3rd line will be fun to watch. If Bozak gets dealt to open up cap then it’s wide open.MattyIce wrote: Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:18 pm IMO for the Blues to be a true contender next year, they need Thomas to make the jump into the top six and Kyrou to become a productive everyday player. I know Perron, ROR, and Sanford play well together, but man I hate seeing Sanford's name on the top line
Re: Robert Thomas
12Wouldn't that just generate even more choruses of: "SHOOOOO-ooooot!" from the EC crowd?Cujo's Mask wrote: Thu Oct 08, 2020 7:30 pm... Hard for me to get excited about Thomas on the third line again unless they get a good finisher to play off his passing skills on that line. I guess he could make up for the lack of 5-on-5 time on the third line with more PP time.