Jed and Bouw will get all the PK time. I expect to see Dunn on a PP unit.

The thing about Dunn is his confidence. It's ridiculous. He goes for plays that Petro and Colton won't go for. Yeah he got burned a few times, but not nearly as often or as costly as you might expect from a 20 year old rookie in the NHL.

Yeah he is going to take on more responsibility. I am very confident he can handle it.

I'm beginning to think why mess with perfection. There's an article from Sportsnet last January that statistically ranked the top 5 lines in the NHL. And the Schwartz/Schenn/Tarasenko line was a close 2nd to the Marchand/Pastrnak/Bergeron line.

I'm inclined to think the Blues should just keep those guys together. At least most of the time.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/bre ... irst-half/

BillP wrote:I'm beginning to think why mess with perfection. There's an article from Sportsnet last January that statistically ranked the top 5 lines in the NHL. And the Schwartz/Schenn/Tarasenko line was a close 2nd to the Marchand/Pastrnak/Bergeron line.

I'm inclined to think the Blues should just keep those guys together. At least most of the time.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/bre ... irst-half/

Schwartz's injury last year crippled this team. Fingers crossed he can stay healthy.

(Does Jake go in to as big a slump if we score a few more goals and win a few more games...?)

39hurricane wrote:

BillP wrote:I'm beginning to think why mess with perfection. There's an article from Sportsnet last January that statistically ranked the top 5 lines in the NHL. And the Schwartz/Schenn/Tarasenko line was a close 2nd to the Marchand/Pastrnak/Bergeron line.

I'm inclined to think the Blues should just keep those guys together. At least most of the time.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/bre ... irst-half/

Schwartz's injury last year crippled this team. Fingers crossed he can stay healthy.

(Does Jake go in to as big a slump if we score a few more goals and win a few more games...?)

A big reason Schwartz's injury crippled the team is that we had no scoring depth after that first line (aside from Stastny at center). We had other injured/recovering guys (Fabbri, Berglund, Steen), or guys who shouldn't have been more than 3rd liners (Jaskin, Sobotka, Barbashev, Paajarvi).

39hurricane wrote:

BillP wrote:I'm beginning to think why mess with perfection. There's an article from Sportsnet last January that statistically ranked the top 5 lines in the NHL. And the Schwartz/Schenn/Tarasenko line was a close 2nd to the Marchand/Pastrnak/Bergeron line.

I'm inclined to think the Blues should just keep those guys together. At least most of the time.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/bre ... irst-half/

Schwartz's injury last year crippled this team. Fingers crossed he can stay healthy.

(Does Jake go in to as big a slump if we score a few more goals and win a few more games...?)

He'll go from being a goalie that can't be counted on to a goalie that makes the big save when he has to if the Blues end up scoring more goals this year & win while doing it. 2 years ago with Hitch I thought he melted into oblivion but I didn't think he was that bad last year and it got blown out of proportion. Nonetheless he still has to prove himself worthy of being our goalie come playoff time this year.

BillP. wrote:

39hurricane wrote:

BillP wrote:I'm beginning to think why mess with perfection. There's an article from Sportsnet last January that statistically ranked the top 5 lines in the NHL. And the Schwartz/Schenn/Tarasenko line was a close 2nd to the Marchand/Pastrnak/Bergeron line.

I'm inclined to think the Blues should just keep those guys together. At least most of the time.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/bre ... irst-half/

Schwartz's injury last year crippled this team. Fingers crossed he can stay healthy.

(Does Jake go in to as big a slump if we score a few more goals and win a few more games...?)

He'll go from being a goalie that can't be counted on to a goalie that makes the big save when he has to if the Blues end up scoring more goals this year & win while doing it. 2 years ago with Hitch I thought he melted into oblivion but I didn't think he was that bad last year and it got blown out of proportion. Nonetheless he still has to prove himself worthy of being our goalie come playoff time this year.

I agree with the bolded, but only to the extent that the poor efforts weren't as concentrated in the schedule as they were the year before, and his abysmal W-L record during a stretch last season seemed to amplify that situation a bit more than his play may have justified during that stretch. Still, his underlying numbers from 2017-18 are pretty awful.

He had a .920 SP or better in only 19 of his 59 appearances last year.
He had a .915 SP or better in only 24 of his 59 appearances last year.
A .915 SP is around league average, so he was at league average or better in just over 40% of his appearances. That is simply not good enough, and I'm sure he would agree.

He gave up 6 goals in a game one time (11/13/17 @ CGY)
He gave up 5 goals in a game three times, including once in less than 37 minutes (1/9/18 vs. FLA)
He gave up 4 goals in a game nine times, including once in less than 24 minutes (11/7/17 vs. NYI)
He started 56 games last season and he gave up 4 or more goals in 13 of them or just over 23% of them.
By contrast, he gave up 1 goal or fewer in 11 of his 56 starts or just under 20% of his starts.

MissouriMook wrote:
I agree with the bolded, but only to the extent that the poor efforts weren't as concentrated in the schedule as they were the year before, and his abysmal W-L record during a stretch last season seemed to amplify that situation a bit more than his play may have justified during that stretch. Still, his underlying numbers from 2017-18 are pretty awful.

He had a .920 SP or better in only 19 of his 59 appearances last year.
He had a .915 SP or better in only 24 of his 59 appearances last year.
A .915 SP is around league average, so he was at league average or better in just over 40% of his appearances. That is simply not good enough, and I'm sure he would agree.

He gave up 6 goals in a game one time (11/13/17 @ CGY)
He gave up 5 goals in a game three times, including once in less than 37 minutes (1/9/18 vs. FLA)
He gave up 4 goals in a game nine times, including once in less than 24 minutes (11/7/17 vs. NYI)
He started 56 games last season and he gave up 4 or more goals in 13 of them or just over 23% of them.
By contrast, he gave up 1 goal or fewer in 11 of his 56 starts or just under 20% of his starts.

Some good info. Thanks.

I think the lack of goal support got in his head. Everyone gets a fresh start this year, let's just hope Jake takes advantage and shows he's a good team player. I remember Tarasenko getting ticked off at fans' derision of Allen when he got in his slump last year. I also recall the team defense was horrendous at times as well, which was equally inexplicable to me as Allen's funk. Sure, we're Blues fans so I suppose we should fret about something, but all in due time.

blueslifer wrote:I remember Tarasenko getting ticked off at fans' derision of Allen when he got in his slump last year.

publicly, sure. i bet he said something completely different off-mic.

The more I think about it I think we see Thomas lining up with Schenn and Schwartz and once Fabbri is a bit more up to speed he should be back with Tarasenko. I think our best options for fourth line type players are actually Steen and Maroon. Steen and Maroon will both get PK and PP time respectively as well. Plus I still think Kyrou plays his way onto this squad.

So by end of October:

Fabbri O'Reilly Tarasenko
Schwartz Thomas Schenn
Perron Bozak Kyrou
Steen Barbashev Maroon

Edmundson Pietrangelo
Dunn Parayko
Bouwmeester Bortuzzo

extras: Jaskin Soshnikov Gunnarsson

With the forward depth I see no reason to push Fabbri anytime early. He shouldn’t be out there getting top line 18-20 minutes. 13-15 is what I’m hoping for. Put him on the 3rd line and let him get some PP time

ratonmono wrote:The more I think about it I think we see Thomas lining up with Schenn and Schwartz and once Fabbri is a bit more up to speed he should be back with Tarasenko. I think our best options for fourth line type players are actually Steen and Maroon. Steen and Maroon will both get PK and PP time respectively as well. Plus I still think Kyrou plays his way onto this squad.

So by end of October:

Fabbri O'Reilly Tarasenko
Schwartz Thomas Schenn
Perron Bozak Kyrou
Steen Barbashev Maroon

Edmundson Pietrangelo
Dunn Parayko
Bouwmeester Bortuzzo

extras: Jaskin Soshnikov Gunnarsson

We have SO MANY QUALITY FORWARDS!!! It is so awesome to play around with the lineup and not want to barf after the first line. I mean, we ended the year with Brodz on the second line. Good lord. On paper, this team is leaps and bounds better that last year's team.

Only edit to your lineup, I really think they are going to work Maroon in with ROR and Tank. I was also thinking of something the other day. A fourth line of Fabbri-Thomas-Kyrou would be really cool. No pressure on any of them since they are on the 4th line. Tons of skill and potential.

Maroon is not going to play on the 4th line. Army has made a promise to negotiate an extension. That's how he got Pat to sign at a discount. Yeah I know his health history. But Pat could have gotten more money elsewhere.

Pat is playing in the top 6 till the contract is extended. Plus he is the kind of addition we need at the top, whether its with Schenn and Tank, or ROR and Perron, he is the Backes like player we have been missing. This team will be much better with some dirty rebound net front goals. That's why Army signed Pat.

Having Pat in the top 6 allows you to spread talent down the lines. Steen Bozak Thomas is a really good third line. Then you roll out Sosh Barbs Jaskin. 4 well balanced lines.

Pat is a 0.47 ppg player over his career. You don't put that in your bottom 6.

I've enjoyed this thread quite a bit. Unfortunately, all of the gorgeous combos we've put together will be thrown in the dumpster when there are 2-3 injuries in camp. The good news is that the depth is there to handle those injuries on paper.

39hurricane wrote:Maroon is not going to play on the 4th line. Army has made a promise to negotiate an extension. That's how he got Pat to sign at a discount. Yeah I know his health history. But Pat could have gotten more money elsewhere.

Pat is playing in the top 6 till the contract is extended. Plus he is the kind of addition we need at the top, whether its with Schenn and Tank, or ROR and Perron, he is the Backes like player we have been missing. This team will be much better with some dirty rebound net front goals. That's why Army signed Pat.

Having Pat in the top 6 allows you to spread talent down the lines. Steen Bozak Thomas is a really good third line. Then you roll out Sosh Barbs Jaskin. 4 well balanced lines.

Pat is a 0.47 ppg player over his career. You don't put that in your bottom 6.

I could see him anywhere in the lineup. He will certainly get PP time but there's only so many minutes to go around but I'd rather not see Jaskin in the lineup at all. Not a huge fan of Sosh or Barbashev either. Honestly our 4th line is kind of a mess despite all the top 9 options. Which is why I'd like to see Kyrou get a good long look and bump some vets down that are better suited to 4th line matchups.

ratonmono wrote:
I could see him anywhere in the lineup. He will certainly get PP time but there's only so many minutes to go around but I'd rather not see Jaskin in the lineup at all. Not a huge fan of Sosh or Barbashev either. Honestly our 4th line is kind of a mess despite all the top 9 options. Which is why I'd like to see Kyrou get a good long look and bump some vets down that are better suited to 4th line matchups.

I think Barbashev will turn some heads this season. He has offensive skill with some grit. I could see him pushing to be on the third line.

I'd think of Maroon more as a replacement for Troy Brouwer than for Backes, as an excellent complementary winger rather as the go-to guy. I don't expect him to score more than 15 goals or so, but I think his play in front of the net and opening up room for his linemates will be critical. If we could re-build something like the Brouwer-Stastny-Fabbri line from the playoffs a couple of years ago, that would be a GREAT second line. Maybe Maroon-ROR-Fabbri/Kyrou/Perron?

Doug Glatt wrote:

ratonmono wrote:
I could see him anywhere in the lineup. He will certainly get PP time but there's only so many minutes to go around but I'd rather not see Jaskin in the lineup at all. Not a huge fan of Sosh or Barbashev either. Honestly our 4th line is kind of a mess despite all the top 9 options. Which is why I'd like to see Kyrou get a good long look and bump some vets down that are better suited to 4th line matchups.

I think Barbashev will turn some heads this season. He has offensive skill with some grit. I could see him pushing to be on the third line.

That would be nice. He was looking very promising two years ago but last season was a pretty big step back. Hopefully he can bounce back. And to be fair he was looking better by the end of the year.

Maroon is gonna get top 6 mins for sure just based on that contract.
If we aren’t letting our young guys learn and play though...it’s still a fail on managements part. We need the youth injection of Thomas and Kyrou. The team will feed off their energy.

NHLTIM wrote:Maroon is gonna get top 6 mins for sure just based on that contract.
If we aren’t letting our young guys learn and play though...it’s still a fail on managements part. We need the youth injection of Thomas and Kyrou. The team will feed off their energy.

Do Kyrou and Thomas get chances at the same time? They are both going to start out at RW I assume. Good to have some more right handed shots in the forward group. RW depth is Tank Perron Thomas Kyrou??? That could give you a 4th line of Jaskin Barbs Kyrou. could be interesting. Tell Barbs and Jaskin to smash into things and see if Kyrou can get some points.

NHLTIM wrote:Maroon is gonna get top 6 mins for sure just based on that contract.
If we aren’t letting our young guys learn and play though...it’s still a fail on managements part. We need the youth injection of Thomas and Kyrou. The team will feed off their energy.

Thomas out of camp. Kyrou later in the season since he goes to AHL. That's probably what happens.

39hurricane wrote:

NHLTIM wrote:Maroon is gonna get top 6 mins for sure just based on that contract.
If we aren’t letting our young guys learn and play though...it’s still a fail on managements part. We need the youth injection of Thomas and Kyrou. The team will feed off their energy.

Do Kyrou and Thomas get chances at the same time? They are both going to start out at RW I assume. Good to have some more right handed shots in the forward group. RW depth is Tank Perron Thomas Kyrou??? That could give you a 4th line of Jaskin Barbs Kyrou. could be interesting. Tell Barbs and Jaskin to smash into things and see if Kyrou can get some points.

We could see the kids start out on the 4th I suppose, though there are inherent issues with trying that.

Maroon O'Reilly Tarasenko
Schwartz Schenn Perron
Steen Bozak Fabbri
Barbashev Thomas Kyrou

I wouldn't mind seeing that.

Doug Glatt wrote:

NHLTIM wrote:Maroon is gonna get top 6 mins for sure just based on that contract.
If we aren’t letting our young guys learn and play though...it’s still a fail on managements part. We need the youth injection of Thomas and Kyrou. The team will feed off their energy.

Thomas out of camp. Kyrou later in the season since he goes to AHL. That's probably what happens.

That’s the easy way out...if Kyrou comes to camp and earns it then he should reap those benefits.

Man looking at things I really wish we could find a taker for Steen.

ratonmono wrote:Man looking at things I really wish we could find a taker for Steen.

I'm curious as to why you feel that way. It's not as if we need the cap space, or have a logical target to use it on if we had it. Personally, I'd rather have him in the lineup than whoever is going to be our 13th forward when everyone is healthy.